Front Coilover suspension design
I am designing a coilover setup for my Pajero IO, The idea is to have them adjustable from 50mm to 100mm. Im going to do a diff drop / body lift of 50mm so I can lift the front suspension 100mm. If im not mistaken? this will allow for 50mm droop and about 150mm compression with 31" tires, Or at 50mm lift, 100mm of droop and about 100mm of compression from static ride height. Im not sure what setup would be best? I guess it depends on spring rates and the tracks being driven? and whether your going to disconnect the sway bar to make use of the potential for large articulation. Ill have to do some testing with different setups :)
I also plan to have them usable without the 50mm diff drop spacers for a 50mm lift ONLY. The ride height will be done via the ride height adjustment in order to keep the droop at or below 50mm (to avoid high CV angles) with this setup. But with the spacers (diff drop) installed the ride height may be adjusted with the spring seat adjustment in order to increase the sag potential for larger articulation.
The bump stops will have to be changed depending on the setup used. LOTS to calculate but im hoping someone else can jump in here and help me with some info?
Does anyone know what travel the IO is capable of? I realize the CVs are the limiting factor, and worse on one side than the other. (maybe I could allow more droop and travel on the side with the longer drive shaft?) From my calculations 250mm would be achievable on both sides, But tyre clearance may be the issue with the up stroke.
Heres a pic of what im drawing up in CAD at the moment.
Is this what you are talking
Is this what you are talking about?
with the wheel at FULL down travel I need to make sure there is clearance between the driveshaft and the strut / coilover?
Love your username too! Pininokio, I only just realized! (Pinokio) :) I hope you have a small nose ! :)
my nose is not to big
my nose is not to big heheheh:P
with the wheel at full down travel if you try to turn the wheel you ll se that it will turn with difficulty.thatsd whats dangerous for the shaft to break.so thats is the longest travel that you may have.and that is how long you make the shocks.(-1-2cm to be sure).now if you place aspacer to lower the bridge you will gain some extra travel.
Ahh yes, The maximum angle
Ahh yes, The maximum angle the CV joint can take? The right side is shorter than the left so the drive shaft reaches a larger angle?
I was thinking about this! I was going to test it as you say, find the limit when the wheel is hard to turn with the steering wheel at full lock left and right. Then, as you say, back it off 10 - 20mm.
What is the extra amount of full down travel you can manage to archive over the stock amount? I read people using 50mm spacers on top of the strut, between the body and the strut, to give a 50mm lift. So i assume 50mm extra down travel is OK ?
legal mod option
I've had issues in the past with car insurance and mods so most of my posts will be angled that way - not because I don't want a massive lift, but because i look for somthing that will not cause my insurance to be voided ;)
The approach i'm taking centers around the KONI strut inserts for the io.
For fitting the KONI replacement the basic operation is that you gut your current sealed oil/gas struts, drill a hole out the bottom of the tube, cut the top off the strut to pull out the guts/shaft/seals etc and oil then press/bolt in a cartridge that slides neat inside the existing strut tube. The cartridge is held in place by a bolt through the bottom and some ribs that are a press-fit inside the old strut tube.
once you have gutted your existing struts it is a great opertunity to cut off and re-weld the spring seats on higher up the tube. You can also drop an alloy spacer down inside the strut tube so the KONI insert sits higher. If you move the spring seat up the same amount as the alloy spacer you effectivly make your struts that much longer. While this doesn't give you more travel, it does allow bigger tyres and as long as you move the diff down the same amount you can also guarantee no CV joint issues however 25mm shouldn't cause too many issues
I'm looking at moving the spring seat up 25mm and in turn lengthening the strut 1" THEN fitting dobinson's 35mm lift spring to give about 50mm lift (a lot for a little car like this, plus whatever lift i get from enlarging the tyres)
you can buy coilovers for the io, but they are all aimed at lowering the car for driting, not exactly the result we are seeking
Hope this helps!
Thanks
kony ref
Hello,
Me again, I am like a sponge, haven't be able to get much info, and now;;;;much better with this forum...
Do you have a ref for these kony insert? some price maybe?
I think these and the mazda tribute wheel should work very well...
Thanks
Claude/ Claud io
Koni Inserts
Thats a great way to go I think, Have you priced up this option?
I saw a post you made with a link to people doing the Koni swap, I cant find it now tho, Can you post that link again?
I used alloy spacers in the last pair of coilovers I made (but like you said it whe shortest Koni fully adjustable race incerts they have and just used an aloy spacer to get it where I wanted it.
Just used off the shelf parts and modified them for these coilovers. But the coilovers im designing for my Pajero iO are new from head to toe :) Cant afford to have my beast off the road while modifient the original ones for to long. plus I wanted them to have adjustable ride height also. Not aimed at lowering :) ) I knew what travel I wanted, but wasn't sure where I would end up centering it in the strut, So i got td at lowering :)
So people drift Pajero iOs? I must admit I was amazed at how well these things drift! heaps of fun.
Currently I have Jamex vw
Currently I have Jamex vw golf mk2 coilovers fitted via a home made extention to the original shock mounts.
These are the original struts which I have cut and raised the spring plate up by 45mm to ensure that when I do fit them there will be plenty of room for the 215/85r16 tyres..
Nice work ando,Whats the
Nice work ando,
Whats the travel on those VW coilovers? looks like it would be short. with the reduced body length etc. I have a feeling evo1 - 3 struts mount in on the bottom OK, just need to make sure the 3 bolts on top are in the right spot, but they ahve the same problem of been a short travel hard spring rate setup.
I think I have found a cheap-ish coil over conversion option for the std struts. Im still in favor of doubling the shock travel with some purpose build coilovers, but in order to fit some larger tyres its a good option.
I have spent a lot of time calculating the spring requirements to get the same as standard ride, all you need are some 150lb/inch 300mm coilover springs, King springs make some KPS-184-X5K 300mm Extended 65mm ID 150lb/inch 98mm Compressed. with a $150 coilover kit.
Just cut the excess metal from the old spring perch so your new tyres fit :)
Alternatively you could use some shorter, stiffer springs. But it will perform much better with the softer spring rate springs at a higher preload.
The springs in the pics are just for show, ortho they would work, there about double the spring rate of the standard springs and would require no preload.
The standard springs have around 100mm of preload
Cheers Glen. The suspension
Cheers Glen. The suspension travel is only about 110mm and the spring rate is too high at roughly 300lb.
I would agree that 150lb would be ideal, this matches the rough calculations I have done on online calculators.
My primary reason for going for the coilover was the ability to fit a larger tyre, I have 29" on now rather than the 26" that were the original size..but also like the adjustability of the system for height and spring rate.
Its very interesting seeing how you have gone about it, it makes a lot of sense....there are certainly quite a few ways of solving the pinin front suspension and tyre fitment problem.
These might be of interest to
These might be of interest to someone in AU planning a coilover conversion - look like the same springs that Glenn mentions above, going cheap!
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/King-Springs-ProSport-Coilover-150lbs-300mm-6...
Pedders
Pedders do a coilover strut made for the lancer 96-00 & 01-07 and also the lancer evo 7,8,9,10.
i was wondering if it might fit the iO. anyone who knows could you confirm. basically im asking is the lancer and iO suspension setup the same.
http://www.pedders.com.au/products/52/140
the only thing im worried about is ride height. i know this model is adjustable, but i want to know if it will suit an iO, i mean for offroading purposes, im also worried about the travel of the strut as it is for road cars, im worried i might need a longer strut body....
i just think that for insurance purposes it would be better than DIY...
although if ride height was really an issue, i could just get strut spacers??? please help me out here...
also glen in these pictures, how is the coilover kit secured to the strut body, and what kind of kit is it?
coilover struts
also trying to find offroad coilover STRUTS as opposed to shocks is seemingly hard. i cant find them anywhere... the only struts i can find are for street cars like the pedders ones i mentioned earlier
this is what im looking for
http://www.dirtyimpreza.com/index.php/projectrs/article/more_scraping_an...
http://parts.allwheelsdriven.net/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=...
but at $2500 theyve gotta be dreaming...
coil over
Hello Daniel,
I don't think that there is a coil over for the io, I think that the coil over is adaptable to most strut (as long as you have the correct size to fit on the cylinder of the strut). I have never done it and I could be completely wrong (ask my wife...!) This is just my understanding and Glen, and other, could confirm or not and help you a bit more.
Happy io
.
also glen in these pictures, how is the coilover kit secured to the strut body, and what kind of kit is it?
I dont know if its meantioned in this thread or another. But Glen said the sleeve and spring was a Honda kit from Ebay. A quick search finds them for about 180 bucks if I remember. Although you get 4.
I then looked into finding a Koni insert to extend the travel. But I could only find ones that barely met the travel or max height of the stock io let alone anything longer.
The threaded sleeves just sit
The threaded sleeves just sit on the stock spring seat. on my race car struts i welded on some steel rings for the sleeves to sit on. But the stock struts are already in the perfect position. The threaded sleeves just slide overtop of the strut body and sit on the std spring seat, You can slice/grind it off and weld a nice new ring on IF you want, but its more than OK as is.
tr4brazuca wrote: HELLO I SAW
HELLO
I SAW YOU HAVE DONE THE PERFECT ORIGINAL MODIFIENT, BUT THESE PICS OF KONI STRUTS, ARE THE NEW ONE 'HEAD TO TOE' DEISGNED? IF THEY´RE COULD YOU SEND THE .3DM FILE. TO I BE ABLE HERE IN BRAZIL TO DO THAT!
THANKS MATE
The Koni struts are for my race car, not the TR4,
But Koni do make shocks for the iO struts. you could use them and do this same mod to coil over. If going to that extent Id just use weld on steel threaded sleeve for the coil over conversion and use normal strut incerts, Koni have many to choose from that would be suitable, probably some with more travel too.
Syndicate
the problem is the right
the problem is the right short shaft.after you finish with the body lift check out the travel of the shaft.your coilover travel should be 2-3 cm shorter to avoid breaking the drive shaft.