Front diff drop?
Can anyone give me some information on dropping my front diff down, has anyone on this forum done this with their io's if so how much and how did it turn out? i want to put the old front springs back in my io with a strut spacer so it will give me some more articulation in the front, with dobinson coils there is little to no drop in the front, very happy with the rear coils tho.
I'm looking at this as
I'm looking at this as well,
I'll get a set of spare struts from a wreck and see how far I can safely extend them with the koni inserts and potentially match this to the dif drop. I'd like to keep the io front sprongs as stiffening the front will make the ride harsher
slightly concerned about the angle change on the front prop-shaft, might be worth shaving the dif drop spacers such that the dif rotates slightly forward to lessen the bend on the front uni. I did this to the lada I owned and it removed 99% of the vibrations out of the transfercase.
I was thinking some billet 25-30mm square alluminium bar would be better than steel box, definitly stronger and less likely to deform, probably viewed more favourably by rego authorities too would allow for the ends to be angled at 45 to spread the load onto the chasis rails considering that any spacing will simply create a mild lever effect onto the flat plate of the chasis rail
I guess also don't forget to extend brake hoses ;)
I'm looking at this as
I'm looking at this as well,
I'll get a set of spare struts from a wreck and see how far I can safely extend them with the koni inserts and potentially match this to the dif drop. I'd like to keep the io front sprongs as stiffening the front will make the ride harsher
slightly concerned about the angle change on the front prop-shaft, might be worth shaving the dif drop spacers such that the dif rotates slightly forward to lessen the bend on the front uni. I did this to the lada I owned and it removed 99% of the vibrations out of the transfercase.
I was thinking some billet 25-30mm square alluminium bar would be better than steel box, definitly stronger and less likely to deform, probably viewed more favourably by rego authorities too would allow for the ends to be angled at 45 to spread the load onto the chasis rails considering that any spacing will simply create a mild lever effect onto the flat plate of the chasis rail
I guess also don't forget to extend brake hoses ;)
stupid dutchmen
just a couple of stupid questions from the dutchman:
- when doing a diff drop should the coil be extended seeing its shorter?
- will the strud shaft (screwing into the body) be long enough when the diff is dropped?
- should you put a spacer in above the coil between the body?
- what exactly does a diff drop do? what do you gain?
- if i do the diff drop, keep my original kyb lifted strut in and fit a 30mm spacer to my original mags will i be able to fit a 245/75/15 in there? wont it get stuck underneath the arches?
if someone can answer the questions and elabarate some more seeing that i really dont understand, i would really appreaciate it
thanx
The diff drop has absolutely
The diff drop has absolutely no effect on your struts at all, the only advantage to dropping the diff is to decrease the angle of the drive shafts/ decrease the Angle in the CVs so they dont break when you do give it a big lift.
If for example, you put a 50mm spacer above the struts, between the body and the strut, to give you a 50mm lift, and then do a 50mm diff drop to bring the shaft / CV angles back as they were, you have basically just done a body lift. The suspension and everything is just the same as STD, and nothing has really changed other than the height of the body form the ground. If you could put longer shock inserts in the strut at the same time, then it would give you an extra advantage in that you could now compress the suspension an extra 50mm before the wheel was in its STD fully compresses position.
With STD or KYB struts you will not have the problem with the CV angles no mater how much you lift it via the spring, as the shock will limit the down travel before the CV angles get too hi, but if you lift the car by putting spacers on top of the strut then the CV angles will increase. I am told that a 50mm spacer on top of the strut is the limit for the CV angles. Thats where the diff drop comes into play, If you drop the diff 50mm also you could go as height as a 100mm spacer above the strut before the CV angles were at there max again.
Ill do some CAD drawings to show whats going on for you, but I probably will not get a chance until next week.
245/75/16 will probably hit the spring seat on the KYB struts, a 50mm spacer MIGHT put them out far enough to clear, you should get an extra 1" clearance from the spring seat when spaced out 2" so in theory you could go up 2" in tire size over what will fit in stock location. But as has been discussed on here in another thread, it seems not all KYB struts have the spring seat up any higher, so check that out first.
If you have the ability, and you really want 245s then you should reweld the spring seat up high enough to clear your tyres, this will also give you a lift, (weld the seat up 40mm and you will get a 40mm lift, Just remember, this will chew into your shocks travel.
But this combined with some 30mm spacers will probably do the trick.
With any luck ill try and fit my 245/75 early next week, ill take some pics and show you the clearance (or lack of) (i have 50mm spacers)
Recent diff drop update from Sem Loção 4WD via Brazil
There has been some dramatical updates on how to drop your diff from our friend from Brazil. I think we should go ahead on the thread intented so make sure we keep all the info together. Here's some pics from Sem Loção 4WD
Some nylon/tecnyl spacers he inserted between the body & diff mounts:
Diff mounting
Just had a look at the way Ill do the diff drop and its not that difficuilt. My only concern I saw and Sem Loção 4WD never post a pic of it is the diff mouting thats above the diff. (Dont know what to call it) Its linked to the complete system where spacers should be inserted as well. Should the front torsion arm also get a spacer in?
Cheers 4 eers!!!
Hello,
hi, Fielies...
the torsion arms I didn't change nothing.... they just swing down to follow the displacement of the diff...
Regarding the mount you highlighted, I didn't change it too... Gotta see it better, but my fellows here that have the same diff drop, didn't place a spacer there too.
I'm guessing if it is this piece from the original idea poster at pajeroclub.gr
here at the pajeroclub.gr pic, a spacer was put in there..
My impression is that this piece is firmly atached tothe crossmember mount, so it went down too....
Cheers!
the place
This is a pic I took from my vehicle before making the diff drop, and the notes (in portuguese) were showing exsctley the place. I was asking someone who already did the diff drop If i shuold not place a spacer in ther, nd he aswered me no.
As I saw the drop being made ath the shop, in fact this piece easily was displaced down with the crossmember....
Cheers!
OK Correct me if i'm
OK Correct me if i'm wrong.
All that needs to be done is to achieve a dif drop, to put some spacers in between where the dif is mounted to the body, front and rear to keep it all level. Ideally you would put some some spacers above the strut aswell so you don't lose any articulation?
So for so good
yep, that's what I've done. Some TR4 owners here in Brazil did the same... untill now, no related problens, except for that bloody vacuum hose that was loose when the diif dropped, easily fixed (in my "Engraçadinha from Brazil" thread I guess I showed a picture of it)
One thing I noticed is, probably as result of the change in the working angle of the whole drive shaft (called here as "cardan"), the CT lever shows some vbrations on low gears....
Cheers!
diff drop issues
The problem we here in Australia have is a steering shaft that pokes out the opposite side of the car to you guys :)
Its the only reason I have not done the drop yet. The shaft will hit the engine mount I thingk. So we may have to do an engine drop too! Kinda like anyone doing a body lift in "real" 4x4 has to, not much harder, just need to worry about radiator hoses gear shifters, cabkes and wires etc..
I'll work something out.
Oh wow, I'm a dumb arse! Just
Oh wow, I'm a dumb arse! Just went and had another look and its blatantly obvious that the motor drops with it. Been about a yr since I looked at it. The problem I saw was actually because the motor dropped, there is about 20mm clearance between the intake manifold and the steering shaft. So the motor/diff can only drop so far before it hits. How close is hours after the 25mm drop?
Diff drop
It''s a year since I did it and don't have a measurement, but I recall thinking I couldn't have gone much more than I did - the issue I saw though was that something was going to touch down on the crossmember (not to say the manifold/steering shaft isn't also an issue, I didn't look at that).
If I was to guess I'd say you might manage another 5-10mm than I did, any more and you're up for some more serious engineering.
OK im FINALLY doing my diff
OK im FINALLY doing my diff drop, im aiming for 65mm, The diff is out and getting the 5.285 ratio fitted, So no better time than now. I took the motor xmember bolt out and the steering bolt, then let the motor down slowly checking that no wires or tubes etc were running out of length as everything dropped, I got it down to about 50mm and the steering shaft has touched the intake manifold, (one side 50mm the other 65mm.) The clamp onto the steering rack from the steering shaft also had big gap, I slid the shaft in the fire wall through and that looks like it will be OK, i just want to check how much spline is left to make sure its going to be safe still and how much further I can go, if any. (pics tomorrow) I went inside for dinner, when i came back out, power steering fluid was all over the ground! so i found one hose that became to short LOL, nothing major fortunately. So im tossing up between fitting a 25mm spacer at the engine mount (will lift the motor approx 30mm) or remove the EGR valve on the intake manifold and block it off.. who needs EGR anyway :)( i assume its an EGR valve?)
I bought a length of 50x65mm alloy square to make the spacers from, so if 65mm is to much i can use it for 50mm instead.
Hi from Caerphilly in South
Hi from Caerphilly in South Wales, this is my first post on here
been here a while getting ideas and have decided to fit a 50mm diff drop drop to my rhd 3dr pinin
I'm using 50mm box section with crush tubes welded in and the problems so far are:
the steering shaft touching the inlet manifold, steering shaft is not long enough to reach the rack, rear of the gearbox almost touches the floor, power steering pipe is at its limit, replacing all the bolts as they are not long enough for a 50mm drop, the tie rod / torsion arm brackets also need spacing
I've decided to make spacers to lift the engine back up on the mounts thus clearing the steering from the manifold, putting the engine and gearbox back at the correct angle which will help the rear prop shaft angle too
I'm not sure if the steering shaft will pull through the bulkhead enough safely, if not it will have to be lengthened
Where abouts in NSW? ill be
Where abouts in NSW? ill be back up there with my IO in a week or so, welcome to check out my 60mm drop.
I removed my steering shaft and bearing support, cut the firewall a little in order to mount the bearing support about 20 - 25mm lower. solves 2 problems, 1, doesnt tough the intake manifold and 2, there is enough spline for the steering again.
I bought a longer length of power steeting pipe, easy fix.
I also bought a few longer lengths of vacume hose, you wil also need to replace a few of those.
I drilled a new hole in the gearbox crossmember to lower it, this improved the prop angles etc, needed to grind some where the mount was hitting the gbox (will post pics to show what i mean latter)
I was going to make up some spacers for the motor too, but in the end didnt need to, keeps the CG lower this way too, not going to roll the car so easy:)
I also made up some adaprots for the radiator hosing, this will not take a 50mm drop either..
WIll post a heap of pics soon..
I have put 8000ks on it simce and its all great!
yeah its a fair drive form
yeah its a fair drive form where you are lol
i did consider cutting the bulkhead as it would keep the engine lower which is better for the center of gravity but would not be easy to do well without taking the engine out, but raising the engine back up means the radiator and gearbox mounts don't need adjusting so is a lot less work overall
the steering shaft now clears no problem and i think that adjusting the length of the bottom shaft will sort out the problem
i have made 40mm spacers for the tie rod / torsion bar as there was some give in these and i didn't want it to sit too low (i used 40x60mm box section for the front mount and 40x40mm for the single mount further back
i got these fitted today, i just need to put the struts back on with the hub spacers ( i've gone for the 70mm lift as per TB45IO post) and i should be able to put it back on the ground
Syndicate
Piniokio has done a 30mm?
Piniokio has done a 30mm? diff drop to his. What did you use to do yours Paris?
Themis has done it, 1 pic of his setup below, some more photos of his here http://www.pajeroclub.gr/viewtopic.php?t=41&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=75
Its pretty simple, just some RHS with crush tubes tacked in around the bolts. Im going to make a 5cm setup for mine ASAP. I almost have my 50 - 100mm adjustable lift coilover kit ready to go in, so would like to do the diff drop shortly after. Will post pics as I go.
How big do you want your drop?
I agree with your articulation reasoning! thats one of the reasons I didnt want to go with dobinson springs. I have gone with longer shock travel rather than the spacer above the strut for the same reason. It will require some testing to get the right spring rate for the right terrain too, But with coil overs springs are easy to get in a huge range of rates and lengths, cheap and spring swaps are easy :)
Yippy i-O
31s 245/75/16 BFGs(33s next) 5" lift Coilovers with 290mm stroke. - 5.29 diffs with Kaiser Lockers.