Best Tire size and type? What Have you / Are you using?
Like 'em
Fab, I have been told that the the RTV wheel offset is P24 mm. If this is so, then I believe that the "backspacing" would be almost the same as the standard iO wheel. Since the RTV wheels are 7 inches wide, then they would be 25mm further out on the outside edge than the standard iO wheels. If some one wants to run sevens, then this situation is hard to avoid, but flexy-flares may be the answer.
The standard Falcon wheel is said to be P38 mm, and I believe cannot be fitted to an iO.
I like to deal in facts, so I hope that someone can get their hands on a RTV wheel, or at least get some specs that we can rely on.
Concerning the steel wheels on the Teabag car, they are from a Ford Escape. They are 16 by 6 1/2, and I believe the offset is P28 mm. I just had a look at one, and where the size is stamped into the metal, it says 16X6 1/2 TOPY 28. (Topy is a Japanese wheel manufacturer).
I will re-do my own measurements of these wheels, and the standard iO wheels, and let you know my findings.
I like those Escape wheels and the fact that they are steelies is a huge bonus for me. The offset is the only concern. I know some guys on here are running Mazda Tribute wheels (same deal) so I'd be VERY curious to know the true offset.
Do they protrude past the guards and what size rubber are you running?
Fab.
I may have misinterpreted
I may have misinterpreted that 28 figure. Perhaps that's not the offset. I will measure it, and then we will know for sure. I am running Toyo Open Country AT tyres in size 215/70R16 on my Tribute wheels. The tyres come quite close to the struts at the front, and on my early iO with the lower spring pan, there's not a lot of clearance there either. The wheels don't stick out beyond the body. I am happy with the Toyo's.
Mazda tribute alloys
See detailed pics of my set up here: http://www.pajerio.com/forum/mazda-tribute-wheels
I'm happy with my tribute 16x7" alloys.
They fit straight on without modification, seem to be stronger than standard wheels and they were cheap and plentiful.
With 205/80R16 (29") tyres, they don't scrub at all, the vehicle handles as well as standard with no wandering on the road. They do protrude inwards further than stock, but there has been no ill effects from this, and they come out to fill the guard nicely without extending beyond.
The only mod needed were a couple of heavy duty (thick) steel washers on each stud for the spare wheel so that the rear door shuts properly.
I would be interested to see how they go with 225/75R16's. There could be a bit of rubbing with the wider tyre.
Love it...!!!
See detailed pics of my set up here: http://www.pajerio.com/forum/mazda-tribute-wheels
I'm happy with my tribute 16x7" alloys.
They fit straight on without modification, seem to be stronger than standard wheels and they were cheap and plentiful.
With 205/80R16 (29") tyres, they don't scrub at all, the vehicle handles as well as standard with no wandering on the road. They do protrude inwards further than stock, but there has been no ill effects from this, and they come out to fill the guard nicely without extending beyond.
The only mod needed were a couple of heavy duty (thick) steel washers on each stud for the spare wheel so that the rear door shuts properly.
I would be interested to see how they go with 225/75R16's. There could be a bit of rubbing with the wider tyre.
Wow...they look awesome natsterrr. I was really set on getting 235's or 225's but after seeing your pics and reading how they were a straight out bolt up, I'm not discounting this as a serious option now. Looks mega tough.
I'd still love to see some +38 wheels (eg Outlander wheels) with 235's or 225's fitted just to see if they fit alright without scraping and hanging out of the guards too badly.
Fab.
Facts and Figures
I just did some careful measuring on my wheels.
My standard 16x6 alloys have a backspacing of 136 mm, giving an offset of P46mm, which agrees with the figure cast into the wheel.
My Ford Escape steel 16 x 6 1/2 wheels have a backspacing of 149 mm, giving an offset of P57mm. If you compare the backspacing numbers, you will see that the extra half-an-inch of width is all inwards.
While I was measuring, I checked the overall diameter of the Toyo OPAT 215/70R16's. It is 27.8 inches.
Concerning the RTV steel wheels, I have dropped the idea, since I believe that they would stick out too far (a bit like those Dynamic wheels that FAB72 tried on, only a little worse).
Some basic maths
I just did some careful measuring on my wheels.
My standard 16x6 alloys have a backspacing of 136 mm, giving an offset of P46mm, which agrees with the figure cast into the wheel.
My Ford Escape steel 16 x 6 1/2 wheels have a backspacing of 149 mm, giving an offset of P57mm. If you compare the backspacing numbers, you will see that the extra half-an-inch of width is all inwards.
While I was measuring, I checked the overall diameter of the Toyo OPAT 215/70R16's. It is 27.8 inches.
Concerning the RTV steel wheels, I have dropped the idea, since I believe that they would stick out too far (a bit like those Dynamic wheels that FAB72 tried on, only a little worse).
OK...so let me get these figures down on "e-paper"
Standard io rims: 152.4mm wide (6") with a positive offset of +46 means that you have 106.4mm of rim from the hub surface towards the outside of the car.
Outlander rims: 165.1mm wide (6.5") with a positive offset of +38 means that you have 127.1mm of rim from the hub surface towards the outside of the car.
Dynamic sunnies: 177.8mm wide (7") with a positive offset of +30 means that you have 147.8mm of rim from the hub surface towards the outside of the car.
Hence: The overall change in amount of rim gained from the hub surface to the outside of the car (from standard) is Outlander = 20.7mm. Dynmaic = 41.4mm.
Now I know that the Dynamic rims overshot the body by 10mm, so in theory, the Outlander rims should in fact (having 20.7mm less outward protrusion) sit roughly 10.7mm inside the body work.
OK...it's 4am in the morning here so please feel free to double check my figures and either agree or disagree....but based on these figures and the favourable centre bore size, it's pretty hard for me to pass this up as being the best option.
Fab.
Furthermore....
Furthermore.
The standard io tyre of 215 has 107.5mm of tyre heading towards the strut.
Where as a 235 tyre would have 117.5mm of tyre heading towards the strut. A difference of 10.5mm.
The mean shift in rim position going from an io rim to an Outlander rim gives you a "gain" in rim to strut clearance of 8mm (+46 offset vs. +38). Meaning that a juicy 235 tyre fitted to an Outlander rim will only close the gap between tyre to strut by a measely 2.5mm.
245 you ask? 7mm closer to the strut. So in theory, quite do-able. Just watch the aspect ratio to make sure you don't run out of clearance to the lower strut spring perch or the body work on full lock. Also 245 might be a bit on the extreme side if fitted to a 6.5" wide rim, but for anyone whose seen pics of Glen (Admin's) io with 245's....you gotta admit it looks tough as guts.
And this my dear friends....is why I claim to be a morning person.
Have a great day-io. 
Fab.
FTOs
Good info Fab
I run FTO rims that I think are the same size and offset as Outlanders.
With Kumho MTs 225/75 16 I have 12mm clearance to the bottom of the pan and 20mm between the sidewall and the strut.
At full lock I got a very small amount of rubbing on the inner bodywork at first, haven't heard that for a long time though. I couldn't go any wider on these rims, but Natster's tall 205s look like a good option to gain a bit more ground clearance.
There's a thread somewhere here where Claude and I compared measurements on our tyres that are the same size but different brands. The differences in actual diameter and width are significant so if you're close to the limits ask the tyre place if you can have a rest fitting first.
Math Correction
Fab, I believe that your calculations are not correct.
Remember that an increase in positive offset moves the rim INWARDS in relation to the hub mounting face. (it sounds wrong, but this is how it is defined in the wheel industry)
So, for wheels with positive offset, the dimension that you are trying to calculate will always be less than 1/2 of the rim width.
Let's call the dimension that you want, the "frontspacing". (because it is the opposite of the more common "backspacing") To calculate the frontspacing, we need to take 1/2 of the rim width, and deduct the positive offset.
(To be pickey, since the width of the rim is measured between the inside edges of the rim lips, we also need to add an amount for the width of the lip. This amount may be a little different, depending on whether it is a steel or an alloy wheel.)
So, for the standard 16X6 alloy wheel: The width is 152.4mm. The half-width is 76.2mm. The offset is P46mm. The backspacing is (76.2 + 46) = 122.2mm. If we add on the thickness of the lip we get 136mm which is what our measurements confirm. For this wheel, the frontspacing works out to be: (76.2 - 46) =30.2mm (plus say 13.5mm for the lip of an alloy wheel, gives us 43.7mm).
For the Dynamic 16X7 steel wheel: The width is 177.8mm. The half-width is 88.9mm. The offset is P30mm. The backspacing is (88.9 + 30) = 118.9mm. If we add on the thickness of the lip (say 9.5mm for a steel wheel) we get 128.4mm. For this wheel, the frontspacing works out to be: (88.9 - 30) = 58.9mm (plus the lip, gives us 68.4 mm).
Comparing the 2 wheels above, the Dynamic wheel has 24.7mm greater frontspacing than the standard wheel.
Best wishes.
.
Well I spoke to my mate at Bob Janes to see what they could do, and pretty much found out the same info as was already known. +30 is the closest they can do. I told him to was a bit much out for me, but he ended up talking me into coming around and see it myself. So I will have to wait and see.
Rim fitting
So I went to see my mate at bob janes today to check out rims on the car, I had very little confidence after seeing the photos of what +30 looked like on FAB72s car. OH how I was surprised.
They pretty much sold two options, both 16x7. A black one that is +30, and a white one which is +18. When I got there they only had a +18 to show me. So we tried them out. Here are some photos.
Front -
Front from top -
Front from top with tyre -
Rear -
Others -
I am not looking at those tyres, they were just to see how the fit was.
I was really surprised how well the +18 sat considering FAB72s +30 photos. They look worse then they really are in the photos. They guys there were saying there ones I would needs flares, just. And that +30s would be fine.
Also getting these means I could run 245/75s as there is a bit of free space around the strut, with +30s 245s would not fit.
I am really in two minds where to go with these. I am seriously considering buying these white ones, having them powder coated black and getting flares (I have always dreamed of having flares....)
I should point out these ones are not dynamics likes FABs. But the +30s would be. I dont know if that plays a part or not.
Wow...I'm surprised too. They
Wow...I'm surprised too.
They don't look too bad. In fact, I reckon they fit better than my +30's. Weird???????
Anyway, I played it safe and just bought 7 Outlander alloys from a guy near Sydney. Brand new, still in boxes. I'll dress 6 in rubber (2 spare outback theory) and the 7th will make a good spare for when the missus hits a gutter...whoops...did I say that out loud?
16 x 6.5, +38.
singlecell now you just need
singlecell now you just need these :P
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&ha...
looks real good though.
new rim
Hi Singlece,l I had the same feeling that the picture showing the rim going over the guard was not "the real thing" I had try these size and they were not that bad. Instead of buying the white one and get them painted black, can you order them in black. Do these exist in 6.5 inch...Looking good...
I just found a site that calculate offset comparaison...http://www.1010tires.com/WheelOffsetCalculator.asp very easy to use....
Happy io
seriously looking at buying
seriously looking at buying any if these now.
at $220each fitted and balanced they look the goods... in the 205/80
http://www.bridgestone.com.au/tyres/treads/604v.aspx
and these are roughly the same price... in 235/70
http://www.bridgestone.com.au/tyres/treads/d694.aspx
color
Hi Singlece,l I had the same feeling that the picture showing the rim going over the guard was not "the real thing" I had try these size and they were not that bad. Instead of buying the white one and get them painted black, can you order them in black. Do these exist in 6.5 inch...Looking good...
I just found a site that calculate offset comparaison...http://www.1010tires.com/WheelOffsetCalculator.asp very easy to use....
Happy io
They can get the dynamics in black, but whatever brand this is only came in white.
Its 100 bucks a rim to have them powder coated black so I am going to give that a miss. Ill see a painter I know about sanding and painting them for me, or Ill just leave them white.
Ill probably end up getting 245s on them, as they are the same price as the 225s.
.
These will probably be the tire I get.
http://www.herculestire.com/catalogHercules/hercules_light_truck_trailDiggerMT.html
260 balanced and fitted.
hercules tyres
these look alright too.
http://www.herculestire.com/catalogHercules/hercules_light_truck_terraTr...
where you getting them from?
Hi all, have managed to pick
Hi all, have managed to pick up a set of five mitsi pinin steel wheels today for only £20.00 £4.00 a wheel ! now to put some more aggressive tyres on them , whats the biggest size that will fit under standard struts, i have got an old 205/80 that i can try, would that fit if i put spacers on, if its not going to work i can get the higher spring pan struts and escort springs for the rear.
Andy
rims
Hi Andy, very well done for the rims...cheap as..:) I think that you have a 2005 pinin with the lower strut (245 mm)
The 245 mm strut is not going to let you do much tyre wise and I don't think that the 205/80 is going to fit (will touch the lower plate), but I have been wrong before...ask my wife! and why not trying?!
Happy io
Hi Claude, 215/65 tyre 686mm
Hi Claude, 215/65 tyre 686mm 205/80 tyre 734mm difference 48mm /2 equals 24mm under the strut , will be tight i know, also 205 tyre 5mm narrower,
really need to get my 205 tyre on and see how it is, am thinking with spacers should be ok, only spacers i can find seem to be 31mm wide , seems quite a lot to me , dont want to stress bearing etc to much.
have been playing around with steel wheels today , cant decide whether to paint them gloss black or dark grey , Car is Black.
Andy
black or grey
Black or grey, can't help you on the colour! but you will need several coat to have a nice finish, why not put the first coat of grey on the left side and a first coat of black on the right side, then finish with your choice...both being dark colour that should be feasible
I don't like too much wheel spacer and many tyre shop have discourage me to use them, and if your new wheel have the same original io offset, I think that 31 mm is too much and the tyres might be outside the guard. Someone else have tested that with some normal washer fitted between the disc and the wheel, to see how far you can go, NOT to drive with (it might be Nzio, not sure) If you choose the wheel spacer, I have seen some on ebay.
The reason I think that they might not fit is because I have the 225/75 with the higher (265mm) strut and I have about 10mm free space, the 205/80 is just a bit smaller (again, from brand to brand, size do change). It is going to be VERY close! and I hope that I am wrong. If they are a bit big, a good burn out will give you a few extra mm
Happy io.
spacers
Wasn't me playing with spacers Claude - I'm not much of a fan of them but in any case, 31mm seems a hell of a lot.
I agree with Claude that 205/80 isn't likely to fit, but even if this one you have sitting around to try fits that's no guarantee that a different brand tyre (presumably new, with full tread) will as they vary so much between brands.
i thought that as well 31mm
i thought that as well 31mm seems a lot, think i will bin that idea and go for 334405 struts with my original longer springs and escort coils at the rear, can get new coils here for around £20.00 each, one question , how are the rear springs secured ? never really mucked about with coils before ,
Andy
rear springs
I think that's a good plan Andy - your original dampers are probably due for replacement anyway which makes this a very cheap 1" lift. Rear springs are very easy to fit - just jack up the rear, put stands in under the chassis rails, undo the lower shock absorber mount and the hub will drop far enough to just pull the spring out. Take note of left and right lengths - I and others have found that the right one is 5mm longer than the left, either for torque or because its drivers side. If you struggle to get the shock bolt out use the jack to take up the weight and it will slide out easy (same for refitting).
Andy, What you have described
Andy,
What you have described is the exact set up that I and many others run. To be precise, my rear springs are aftermarket raised King springs but the effect is the same. I followed the advice (eventually) of people like NZIO and Claudio and am happier than a pig in $hit with my set up. OK, it's not extreme, but I want something that maintains reliability and driveability too. It cost me a few hundred $ before I resigned to the fact of admitting defeat after trying other options...don't waste your money unless you're trying to build a competition truck (my opinion).
In my opinion, my current set up is the best combination by far. It allows for the bigger rubber, maintains good articulation on the front by not going stiffer in the springs, puts the strut in the middle of it's travel length, gives a bit more height without making the thing top heavy, maintains good driveline and steering geometry angles, and prevents other issues like premature bearing wear.
I for one (sticking my neck out here) am dead against wheel spacers and infact in many regions, they are illegal (South Australia is one). From an engineering persepctive too, wheels that don't seat on the hub is another no-no. A vehicle's weight should be supported by the hub, not by the wheel studs. For that reason, I have changed my wheels to ZG Outlander wheels (like a few others on here have). The hub bore size is exact and the only difference is the width increase from 6" to 6.5" and a slight offset change from +46 to +38 which is so marginal it won't upset anything but will allow for slightly wider rubber without hitting the strut. The added bonus is the standard wheel centres and wheel nuts fit too. (BTW...my 235/70/16 BF Goodrich Mud Terrain KM2's are getting fitted today - again...a tyre brand and size recommended by a few on here).
Troll through others posts and maybe even look at my detailed suspension upgrade "blog" under the section titled Suspension upgrades "OK...that sucks, broke my strut". Laugh at my trials and tribulations, my admit to defeat and the GREAT advice the above people and others gave me. Save yourself the dollars I wasted and time I spent. But above all...remember that we are all here for one another and no question is a "dumb question". Enjoy.
Fab.
Here she is..................
Just fitted the ZG Outlander rims and brand new BF Goodrich KM2 Mud Terrains in 235/70/16.
Things to note thus far..... the rim/tyre/offset size fits really well. Any bigger and the spare won't fit without raising the spare wheel carrier (it's really close to the rear bumper). And finally....why didn't anyone tell me the wheel caps need to be fitted from the inside...doh!
Now all it needs is a wheel alignment and a bit of wiring tidyed up and she's all set for the June long weekend. Wooo hooo.
Fab.
nice
Hum, what can I say...it all started with "OK..that sucks..." NO MORE! Your io looks great, just wait till you get to the dirt road...Did you had a big smile on your face when you first saw it fitted with his new shoes? probably still have!!
Drive on "all wheel drive" on yet road, or the back get a bit "dancing"...
Well done.
Very happy io.
Thanks guys
Thanks guys .... the feedback is very much appreciated.
Daniel .... you made me blush 
I guess I have achieved what I set out to do which was create a slightly modified touring/off road io without the "Hey look at me element" that often attracts unwanted attention from the local constabulary. It had to be capable enough to have the confidance to take it off road, the street-ability to use it as a daily driver, and be sensible enough that the kids don't asked to be picked up around the corner.
I get a giggle when I look back to the first few paniced posts I wrote when the proverbial hit the fan. I thank the likes of Claudio and NZIO who talked me through the troublesome times and taught me that no matter how much $hit has hit the fan, you can always get a bigger fan.
Not wanting to exclude anyone, the information contained within the posts on this thread and others on this site is just priceless. It's getting to the stage that no matter what you want to do, guaranteed someone has either done it, planning to do it, or is advising against doing it. That's a lot of experience at our finger tips...not to forget our overseas brothers and sisters that have knowledge that just isn't available here in Oz or NZ.
For me now....I'm going to enjoy "Pajio" just as she is. I've still got the idea of the long range tank in the back of my mind, but the urgency is not there just yet.
BTW...... Lancer EVO motor? Triton motor? Never say never. (Unless the missus says "never").
Thanks guys.....I now look forward to being a passive viewer and advisor, rather than an info leech.
Fab - io.
nicely said
Nicely said, that what "pajerio.com" is all about.: try to help each other....
I hope that we are going to see some action shot and maybe some comment on how your io is performing (the good and may be the not so good!) as this will help other to choose tyres, wheel, and other...
Happy io.
tried to order my kyb
tried to order my kyb 334405 struts today, apparently there are none in the uk or the whole of Europe!!
asked when they will be available and they cannot give a date, so will have to hold off on plans for now, if they put them on backorder i have to pay all up front with no guarantee how long it will take.
apparrently theres no problem for you guys in Aus or in the states.
Andy
:(
Andy,
That sucks the big Gelati.
They are readily available here in Aus. When I got mine, I went to my local generic parts store and ordered them. Had them sent overnight from Melbourne.
I know there were some on ebay from an Aussie seller when I bought mine, although they don't appear to be on there now.
Did you try the Mitsi dealer or just go to a local parts store? The Mitsi dealer would be more likely to have them but expect to pay a premium price for them.
I'll have a sniff around and see if I can find a retailer here that sells them and if they ship overseas.
Fab...io.
These guys appear to have
These guys appear to have stock, but it would be worth contacting them to confirm and if they ship o/seas:
http://www.carsrus.com.au/mitsubishi-pajero-io-kyb-shock-absorbers-front-suspension-99-03.html
Syndicate
That sounds spot on. Wasn't
That sounds spot on. Wasn't pretty.
I'm having trouble trying to shake the Escape wheels idea. Googling the offset now. I'm seeing figures of +38, +40 and +46 for Ford Escapes. Probably to do with the different widths, but it's the steelies that have me doing somersaults at the moment.
Fab.
"Love that car"